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The Men Called Christians

- Who is the Pastor and Teacher of the MEN CALLED CHRISTIANS?

- How are they being "fed" with the words of God? Who feeds them?

- What is their primary activity?

 

Nov 04, 1996

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Foreknowledge, free will, and gift-giving

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Joined: Jul 21, 2005
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Posted Jan 11, 2006 at 9:58:07 AM
Subject: Foreknowledge, free will, and gift-giving
[color=darkblue]Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye SAVED THROUGH FAITH; and that not of yourselves: it is the GIFT of God: With God’s love, FAITH is a gift offered to all who have access to His word. And to others, there is no use offering it knowing (foreknowledge) that they would not accept it anyway. The act of gift-giving is consummated with the DECISION of the intended recipient TO ACCEPT the gift. Heb 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God MUST BELIEVE that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him. Rom 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, WE HAVE PEACE with God through our Lord Jesus Christ: [/color]
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Steve
Joined Oct 27, 2005
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Location:Chicago

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Posted: Feb 23, 2006 2:20:09 AM
Romans 12:3 "For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith." This line of scripture still bases our faith on the measure with which it was given, not based on our acceptance. This would agree with Romans 9:11 "(for the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;) Wouldn't it be considered a work to say I have my faith because I accepted it from God? Believers need God's acceptance. 2Cor. 5:9 "Wherefore we labor, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him." Ephesians 1:6 "to the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved:"
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sandra3102
Joined Jul 21, 2005
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Posted: Feb 23, 2006 5:40:30 AM
Is the following not relevant to the subject? Rev 3:5 He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.
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Steve
Joined Oct 27, 2005
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Posted: Feb 23, 2006 6:27:18 AM
We can only overcome because He first overcame just as we love Him only because He first loved us.
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ric32bailey
Joined Jul 21, 2005
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Posted: Feb 23, 2006 9:08:02 AM
I read in the Old Testament that I think is similar to Rev. 3:5: Exo 19:5 Now therefore, [b][color=red]if ye will obey my voice [/color][/b]indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine: Exo 19:6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel. Exo 19:7 And Moses came and called for the elders of the people, and laid before their faces all these words which the LORD commanded him. Exo 19:8 And all the people answered together, and said, All that the LORD hath spoken we will do. And Moses returned the words of the people unto the LORD. Exo 19:9 And the LORD said unto Moses, Lo, I come unto thee in a thick cloud, that the people may hear when I speak with thee, and believe thee for ever. And Moses told the words of the people unto the LORD. Exo 19:10 And the LORD said unto Moses, [color=red][b]Go unto the people[/b][/color], and sanctify them to day and to morrow, and [b][color=red]let them wash their clothes[/color][/b], Exo 19:11 And be ready against the third day: for the third day the LORD will come down in the sight of all the people upon mount Sinai. Exo 19:12 And thou shalt set bounds unto the people round about, saying, [b]Take heed to yourselves, that ye go not up into the mount, or touch the border of it:[/b] whosoever toucheth the mount shall be surely put to death:
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Steve_Jorns1
Joined Jul 21, 2005
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Posted: Feb 24, 2006 1:46:47 AM
Overcoming is not of our own doing. 1Jn. 5:4 "For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith." Again, our faith is a gift from God. Each man given a measure of faith. Rev. 12:11 "And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death." No one can overcome in and of their own doing. It is His blood by which we overcome this world.  [quote] From:  [i]"sandra3102" <bibletalk@purechristianity.org>[/i] Reply-To:  [i]bibletalk@purechristianity.org[/i] To:  [i]bibletalk@purechristianity.org[/i] Subject:  [i]RE: Foreknowledge, free will, and gift-giving[/i] Date:  [i]Wed, 22 Feb 2006 14:40:32 -0700[/i] [quote]Is the following not relevant to the subject? Rev 3:5  He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels. [/quote] [/quote]
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Steve_Jorns1
Joined Jul 21, 2005
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Posted: Feb 24, 2006 1:55:50 AM
Heb. 11:8 "[b]By faith [/b]Abraham, when he was called to go out in to a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, [b]obeyed[/b]; and he went out, not knowing whither he went." [quote] From:  [i]"ric32bailey" <bibletalk@purechristianity.org>[/i] Reply-To:  [i]bibletalk@purechristianity.org[/i] To:  [i]bibletalk@purechristianity.org[/i] Subject:  [i]RE: Foreknowledge, free will, and gift-giving[/i] Date:  [i]Wed, 22 Feb 2006 18:08:03 -0700[/i] [quote]I read in the Old Testament that I think is similar to Rev. 3:5: Exo 19:5  Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine: Exo 19:6  And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel. Exo 19:7  And Moses came and called for the elders of the people, and laid before their faces all these words which the LORD commanded him. Exo 19:8  And all the people answered together, and said, All that the LORD hath spoken we will do. And Moses returned the words of the people unto the LORD. Exo 19:9  And the LORD said unto Moses, Lo, I come unto thee in a thick cloud, that the people may hear when I speak with thee, and believe thee for ever. And Moses told the words of the people unto the LORD. Exo 19:10  And the LORD said unto Moses, Go unto the people, and sanctify them to day and to morrow, and let them wash their clothes, Exo 19:11  And be ready against the third day: for the third day the LORD will come down in the sight of all the people upon mount Sinai. Exo 19:12  And thou shalt set bounds unto the people round about, saying, Take heed to yourselves, that ye go not up into the mount, or touch the border of it: whosoever toucheth the mount shall be surely put to death: [/quote] [/quote]
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Steve
Joined Oct 27, 2005
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Posted: Feb 28, 2006 2:09:11 AM
Is it by faith that we choose? As in Hebrews 11:24-25 "[b]By faith [/b]Moses, when he was come to years, [b]refused[/b] to be called the son of Pharaoh's daughter; [b]choosing rather [/b]to suffer affliction with the people of God, than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a season;"
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ric32bailey
Joined Jul 21, 2005
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Posted: Feb 28, 2006 5:03:03 AM
Subject: My humility
Before, I considered this website as unorthodox. I even called it rebellious since it does not conform to the common teachings about God and His words. It was difficult for me to accept until a deep searching I did to myself. I read some articles over and over again and cannot refute what is written. I suppose that is the beginning of humility that God expects from me. Now I feel the FAITH that God has given me. I find it comfortable following God’s command, although there are many stumbling blocks on the way. Obstructions are difficult to overcome without the strength coming from Him. What I read is God’s chosen before us also encountered all these.
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Joined Nov 23, 2017
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Posted: Dec 24, 2006 8:31:14 AM
This passage is not telling us how one recieves faith, this passage is showing one acting on that faith one has, and what faith is. "Heb.11 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. 2 [b]For by it the elders obtained a good testimony[/b]... 6 But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God [b]must believe that He is[/b], and that [b]He is a rewarder[/b] of those [b]who diligently seek Him[/b]... 8 By faith Abraham, [b]when he was called to go out in to a place which he should after receive for an inheritance[/b], obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went. Now, don't you first have to be willing to turn and hear the truth before you believe He is God, and a rewarder of those who diligently seeking him? Is it just a matter of hearing Jesus speak, or is it a willingness to hear and understand the truth of what Jesus has to say? Romans 10:13 For “[b]whoever calls[/b] on the name of the LORD shall be saved. 14 [b]How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard?[/b] ... How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the gospel of peace,... 16 [b]But they have not all obeyed the gospel[/b]. For Isaiah says, “LORD, who has believed our report?” 17 [b]So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God[/b].18 But I say, [b]have they not heard? Yes indeed[/b]: ...“ [b]All day long I have stretched out My hands To a disobedient and contrary people[/b].” So first you must be willing, then someone must be sent so that you can hear, God removes the vail so you can hear the truth, when you have heard the truth you may now believe, "believeing", you are now acceptable to God and may call on Him, what is in your heart will come out of your mouth and confirm your salvation. If the inside is clean so will the outside become clean (see Matt 23:26). 2 Corinthians 3:15But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the [b]vail is upon their heart[/b]. 16Nevertheless when it shall [b]turn[/b] to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away. Acts 7:51 “[b]You stiff-necked[/b] and uncircumcised in heart and ears! [b]You always resist[/b] the Holy Spirit; as your fathers did, so do you. Rom 10:21 [i]New American Standard Bible[/i] But as for Israel He says, " ALL THE DAY LONG I HAVE STRETCHED OUT MY HANDS TO A DISOBEDIENT AND [b]OBSTINATE[/b] PEOPLE." Rom 10:21 [i]Amplified Bible[/i] But of Israel he says, All day long I have stretched out My hands to a people unyielding and disobedient and [b]self-willed[/b]. Acts 16:13 And on the Sabbath day... where prayer was customarily made... we sat down and spoke to the women who met there. 14 Now a certain woman named Lydia heard us... who worshiped God. The Lord [b]opened[/b] her [b]heart to heed[/b] the [b]things spoken[/b] by Paul. The Lord removed the vail on her heart (opened her heart) so that she could hear the truth (so that she could concider the truth), but you must have a willing heart (willing heart of a child). A self-willed ([b][u]governed by one's own will : not yielding to the wishes of others : OBSTINATE : perversely adhering to an opinion, purpose, or course in spite of reason, arguments, or persuasion <obstinate resistance to change>[/[/u]b]) heart is not willing to hear the truth. So, if one is willing to hear, God will remove the vail, then one can see and hear the truth so that one can believe (recieve the gift of faith) and be saved. Lets not forget the all knowing God knows [u]if[/u] and [u]when[/u] you will have a willing heart. Matt 11:14 And if you are [b]willing[/b] to receive it, he is Elijah who is to come. Matt 23:37 “O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the one who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often [b]I wanted[/b] to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but [b]you[/b] were [b]not willing[/b]! Matt 26:41 Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is [b]willing[/b], but the flesh is weak. Willingness alone is not enough, because the flesh is weak we can do nothing on our own, we need the gift of faith, power of the Holy Spirit. John 5:33 You have sent to John, and he has borne witness to the truth. 34 Yet I do not receive testimony from man, but [b]I say these things that you may be saved[/b]. 35 He was the burning and shining lamp, and you were willing for a time to rejoice in his light. 36 But I have a greater witness than John’s; for the works which the Father has given Me to finish—the very works that I do—bear witness of Me, that the Father has sent Me. 37 And the Father Himself, who sent Me, has testified of Me. [b]You have neither heard His voice at any time, nor seen His form[/b]. 38 But [b]you do not have His word abiding in you, because[/b] whom He sent, [b]Him you do not believe[/b]. 39 [b]You search the Scriptures[/b], for in them [b]you think you have eternal life[/b]; and [b]these[/b] are they which [b]testify of Me[/b]. 40 But [b]you are not willing[/b] to come to Me that you may have life. 41 “I do not receive honor from men. 42 But I know you, that you do not have the love of God in you. 43 I have come in My Father’s name, and you do not receive Me; if another comes in his own name, him you will receive. 44 [b]How can you believe, who receive honor from one another[/b], and do not seek the honor that comes from the only God? 45 Do not think that I shall accuse you to the Father; there is one who accuses you—Moses, in whom you trust. 46 For if you believed Moses, you would believe Me; for he wrote about Me. 47 But if you do not believe his writings, [b]how will you believe My words[/b]?” God gave us a will. We must be willing to hear, to hear the truth. We don't have to believe to be willing, we have to be willing to believe. Abraham was willing to hear and he was willing to go to some place he knew nothing about. If you are willing to hear then God will give you a heart to believe. Here is an example of turning ones will: Luke 22:42 saying, Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but thine, be done. Jesus rejected his will for his fathers, therefore makeing himself willing.

Proverbs 2

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scott_baldwin29
Joined Oct 26, 2005
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Posted: Dec 26, 2006 4:31:00 AM
[color=darkblue]May I venture on the sequence regarding the subject: First God made plan to have eternal companions... Then, He created man... Man stalled the plan of God... All have sinned... God made a provision for redemption...it is free for all... The condition for redemption is acceptance with humility... But the kind of humility is according to God's standard... From thereon God shows the Way... On the Way God guides the humble... On the Way God provides the strength to continue... The condition remains till the end...humility... Again, for emphasis, humility according to God's standard... God provides EVERTHING... The chosen's role is total submission to God according to His terms... All these is easily said than done. Otherwise many would be saved. But the truth is, only a few are willing in the eyes of God...[/color]
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1whosoever
Joined Dec 11, 2006
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Location:U.S, Indiana

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Posted: Jan 26, 2007 8:54:32 AM
[quote:32582ff49a="fil3232003"][color=darkblue]Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye SAVED THROUGH FAITH; and that not of yourselves: it is the GIFT of God: With God’s love, FAITH is a gift offered to all who have access to His word. And to others, there is no use offering it knowing (foreknowledge) that they would not accept it anyway. The act of gift-giving is consummated with the DECISION of the intended recipient TO ACCEPT the gift. Heb 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God MUST BELIEVE that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him. Rom 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, WE HAVE PEACE with God through our Lord Jesus Christ: [/color][/quote] Hi, and Blessings! Just want to ask what you mean about the foreknowledge? I understand that God is omnipotent, omnipresent, omniscient, etc., and of course He knows everything all the time! But does your understanding of that issue mean you believe the gift of Salvation is NOT for everyone? Acts 2: 21 says "And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved." And there's verses that say Jesus died for everyone. What I'm asking is your views on free will versus the views about the "elect" also...... I believe we all have the same opportunity to accept Salvation, whether we're of Jewish descent or Gentile. I believe Jesus died for everyone, not just the "elect"; as most people interpret that word. I believe the Elect are the strongest, most faithful Christians. We are all equal as far as God loving us and saving us; but some are stronger, have more Faith, have been better witnesses for the Lord, etc. I don't believe it matters whether we're the "elect" or not; we'll still go to Heaven either one. Not that it's okay to not strive to be more Jesus-like; some of us just will never be as Spiritually strong as others.....yet God loves us all the same, shows us all mercy. ??

His mercy endureth for ever.

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1whosoever
Joined Dec 11, 2006
Posts: 12
Location:U.S, Indiana

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Posted: Jan 26, 2007 8:57:08 AM
[quote:ad39286f29="fil3232003"][color=darkblue]Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye SAVED THROUGH FAITH; and that not of yourselves: it is the GIFT of God: With God’s love, FAITH is a gift offered to all who have access to His word. And to others, there is no use offering it knowing (foreknowledge) that they would not accept it anyway. The act of gift-giving is consummated with the DECISION of the intended recipient TO ACCEPT the gift. Heb 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God MUST BELIEVE that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him. Rom 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, WE HAVE PEACE with God through our Lord Jesus Christ: [/color][/quote] Hi, and Blessings! Just want to ask what you mean about the foreknowledge? I understand that God is omnipotent, omnipresent, omniscient, etc., and of course He knows everything all the time! But does your understanding of that issue mean you believe the gift of Salvation is NOT for everyone? Acts 2: 21 says "And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved." And there's verses that say Jesus died for everyone. What I'm asking is your views on free will versus the views about the "elect" also...... I believe we all have the same opportunity to accept Salvation, whether we're of Jewish descent or Gentile. I believe Jesus died for everyone, not just the "elect"; as most people interpret that word. I believe the Elect are the strongest, most faithful Christians. We are all equal as far as God loving us and saving us; but some are stronger, have more Faith, have been better witnesses for the Lord, etc. I don't believe it matters whether we're the "elect" or not; we'll still go to Heaven either one. Not that it's okay to not strive to be more Jesus-like; some of us just will never be as Spiritually strong as others.....yet God loves us all the same, shows us all mercy. ??

His mercy endureth for ever.

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cristinolese
Joined Jul 21, 2005
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Posted: Jan 28, 2007 5:33:45 PM
[color=darkblue]1whosoever, It is hoped this is God’s revelation on the subject. God is omniscient investing in Him the ability to know ahead of time. This is “foreknowledge.” Therefore God knows who among the people that would inhabit the earth will believe His inspired words revealed to the prophets and apostles. By virtue of God’s Testament, salvation is available to everyone. However there are two kinds of people regarding salvation with God’s foreknowledge: 1. Those who are given the opportunity to know the terms for salvation, and 2. Those that are not given this choice, for with God’s foreknowledge they would not mind it anyway. However not all people in No. 1 would accept it knowing that it is “free.” “Free” means nothing is expected from the recipient except the “act of receiving.” The “act of receiving” is the kind of “work” revealed: To James in: Jam 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. And to Paul in: Phi 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, WORK OUT YOUR OWN SALVATION WITH FEAR AND TREMBLING. It is not the kind of “work” that the Natural Man (1 Cor 2:14) understands where efforts and capability are the ingredients. Otherwise it will contradict the following: Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 NOT OF WORKS, lest any man should boast. The sequence therefore is revealed to be the following: FIRST – Foreknowledge SECOND – God’s love THIRD – Salvation offered free to everybody FOURTH – “Works” in the language of God that means the individual’s acceptance of salvation as a result of HUMILITY, but not the kind the Natural Man understands. (If pride was the cause of the downfall of Lucifer, God reversed this with His demonstration of humility in manifesting Himself in the flesh.) Thus: Mat 18:3 And said, Verily I say unto you, EXCEPT YE BE CONVERTED, AND BECOME AS LITTLE CHILDREN, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven. Mat 5:3 Blessed are the POOR IN SPIRIT: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. FIFTH – With “works” or acceptance follows the “gift of FAITH.” Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye SAVED THROUGH FAITH; and that not of yourselves: IT IS THE GIFT OF GOD: SIXTH -- It is after receiving the “gift of FAITH” that the trek to salvation begins. On the way, God inspires further humilityon the chosen through “chastisement and trials” (Heb 12:5-7) classifying the chosen to become “elect” where to be “born of God” is the ultimate objective. 1 Joh 5:18 We know that whosoever is BORN OF GOD SINNETH NOT; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not. SEVENTH – Attaining spiritual perfection with total spiritual humility, like the “eldest Son of God,” then it is time for God “harvest the soul.” 1 Joh 3:2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, WHEN HE SHALL APPEAR, WE SHALL BE LIKE HIM; for we shall see him as he is. [/color]
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Last updated on Thu, 23 November 2017 10:07:10 CET